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Post by Juggs on Jul 31, 2015 1:55:46 GMT -5
lol word for word with no context. That means a lot.
Were other Patriots aware? I don't care, since they weren't charged.
You keep saying "wasn't sure" and "isn't even close to conclusive" like those mean anything. Player investigations for suspensions are held to a low standard of evidence that has become infamous: more probable than not. That's all the standard that the league needed, like it or not. If Brady or the union isn't okay with that, they shouldn't have caved on negotiations in 2011.
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Post by nateball89 on Jul 31, 2015 2:11:13 GMT -5
They're really giving Brady the same suspension as Greg Hardy. The NFL... Where plucking a bit of air out of a football is just as heinous a crime as domestic abuse. Cheating in the game that gets you to the Superbowl. "Letting a little bit of air out of some footballs" is a gross marginalization of what has become the byproduct of the New England Patriots' "historic" dynasty: winning by any means necessary, and by winning by any means necessary, we all know that that's cheating. I'm not arguing for or against any suspensions or lengths of suspensions for domestic violence. I refuse to get dragged into that argument. Won't touch it with a ten foot pole. I'm just happy Brady got what he deserved. Btw, what happened to Tom's cellphone? Did he trip, fall, and it accidentally got destroyed in his man satchel and he had to throw it out? I pray to Morgan Freeman that Brady appeals this in court. They'll destroy him. The evidence is so damning, it will look like he's wasting the court's time and trying to make a mockery out of the system by trying to go above his boss's head simply because he didn't like the ruling. Suck it up buttercup. You finally got caught for something and you're finally serving a suspension. Eat it like the rest of the "common men" below you in the NFL.
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Post by Morkim on Jul 31, 2015 3:07:01 GMT -5
They're really giving Brady the same suspension as Greg Hardy. The NFL... Where plucking a bit of air out of a football is just as heinous a crime as domestic abuse. Cheating in the game that gets you to the Superbowl. "Letting a little bit of air out of some footballs" is a gross marginalization of what has become the byproduct of the New England Patriots' "historic" dynasty: winning by any means necessary, and by winning by any means necessary, we all know that that's cheating. I'm not arguing for or against any suspensions or lengths of suspensions for domestic violence. I refuse to get dragged into that argument. Won't touch it with a ten foot pole. I'm just happy Brady got what he deserved. Btw, what happened to Tom's cellphone? Did he trip, fall, and it accidentally got destroyed in his man satchel and he had to throw it out? I pray to Morgan Freeman that Brady appeals this in court. They'll destroy him. The evidence is so damning, it will look like he's wasting the court's time and trying to make a mockery out of the system by trying to go above his boss's head simply because he didn't like the ruling. Suck it up buttercup. You finally got caught for something and you're finally serving a suspension. Eat it like the rest of the "common men" below you in the NFL. You sound so bitter that I'm not going to even ask what all of this damning evidence is. But you should know by now Brady is going to court. So you're getting your wish there. If he gets "destroyed" or not remains to be seen.
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Post by MarchingOn on Jul 31, 2015 3:14:31 GMT -5
They're really giving Brady the same suspension as Greg Hardy. The NFL... Where plucking a bit of air out of a football is just as heinous a crime as domestic abuse. Cheating in the game that gets you to the Superbowl. "Letting a little bit of air out of some footballs" is a gross marginalization of what has become the byproduct of the New England Patriots' "historic" dynasty: winning by any means necessary, and by winning by any means necessary, we all know that that's cheating. I'm not arguing for or against any suspensions or lengths of suspensions for domestic violence. I refuse to get dragged into that argument. Won't touch it with a ten foot pole. I'm just happy Brady got what he deserved. Btw, what happened to Tom's cellphone? Did he trip, fall, and it accidentally got destroyed in his man satchel and he had to throw it out? I pray to Morgan Freeman that Brady appeals this in court. They'll destroy him. The evidence is so damning, it will look like he's wasting the court's time and trying to make a mockery out of the system by trying to go above his boss's head simply because he didn't like the ruling. Suck it up buttercup. You finally got caught for something and you're finally serving a suspension. Eat it like the rest of the "common men" below you in the NFL. I'm not downplaying anything. "Letting a little bit of air out of some footballs" is a 100% accurate description of what supposedly happened. The context (game) in which it happened is irrelevant and not being factored into the punishment (as far as I know, at least). And rightfully so imo, if that is indeed the case. Deflategate is a joke, and is being completely blown out of proportion by people who are so eager to see Brady/the Patriots fail for shallow reasons.
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Post by patriotsk1d on Jul 31, 2015 11:42:56 GMT -5
Mortenson backed out of the interview lol.
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Post by patriotsk1d on Jul 31, 2015 11:44:47 GMT -5
lol word for word with no context. That means a lot. Were other Patriots aware? I don't care, since they weren't charged. You keep saying "wasn't sure" and "isn't even close to conclusive" like those mean anything. Player investigations for suspensions are held to a low standard of evidence that has become infamous: more probable than not. That's all the standard that the league needed, like it or not. If Brady or the union isn't okay with that, they shouldn't have caved on negotiations in 2011. Has a player ever been suspended on this low of a standard? Maybe, but certainly not a player I can think of off the top of my head. If we are using the more probable than not standard, then there is just as much evidence that every other player on the team was aware. And this has nothing to do with caving on 2011 negotiations. The NFL did not follow the rules in the CBA. Only a few more weeks of this crap...
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Post by patriotsk1d on Jul 31, 2015 11:45:37 GMT -5
They're really giving Brady the same suspension as Greg Hardy. The NFL... Where plucking a bit of air out of a football is just as heinous a crime as domestic abuse. Cheating in the game that gets you to the Superbowl. "Letting a little bit of air out of some footballs" is a gross marginalization of what has become the byproduct of the New England Patriots' "historic" dynasty: winning by any means necessary, and by winning by any means necessary, we all know that that's cheating. I'm not arguing for or against any suspensions or lengths of suspensions for domestic violence. I refuse to get dragged into that argument. Won't touch it with a ten foot pole. I'm just happy Brady got what he deserved. Btw, what happened to Tom's cellphone? Did he trip, fall, and it accidentally got destroyed in his man satchel and he had to throw it out? I pray to Morgan Freeman that Brady appeals this in court. They'll destroy him. The evidence is so damning, it will look like he's wasting the court's time and trying to make a mockery out of the system by trying to go above his boss's head simply because he didn't like the ruling. Suck it up buttercup. You finally got caught for something and you're finally serving a suspension. Eat it like the rest of the "common men" below you in the NFL. I really find it incredible that Brady's phone broke. I have never heard of a phone breaking before, only possible since its Brady...
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Post by cityofchamps on Jul 31, 2015 12:03:25 GMT -5
I think I will just give daily updates( not using ESPN's agenda) to keep everyone honest, although everyone is and should be entitled to their own opinion. Chris Mortenson, the guy who overblew this entire thing with a false report stating 11 of the 12 footballs were 2.5 PSI under the legal limit(not even remotely true) will be on the Dennis and Callahan show tomorrow morning to discuss his initial report. While I have never been a fan of Mortenson I doubt he fabricated the original report and think it is far more likely one of the NFL's higher up leaked false information to him. Dennis and Callahan will not let him off easy. Still there is a lot of hype regarding this interview and it wouldnt shock me if Mortenson or ESPN pulls the plug on it in the next few hours. cityofchampsToo bad your fun is about to run out. Your huge deal about the broken cell phone is looking dumber and dumber every day. Another story that doesnt fit your agenda: www.wired.com/2015/07/even-tom-brady-smash-phone-itd-make-zero-sense/?mbid=social_twitterHere is a quote from the Wells report: "We don't even know if a violation occurred, but if one did, we "think" we know who probably did it." Sounds very conclusive. JuggsGoing to have to agree after further research than an injunction is not by any means a guarantee. However judge Berman is expected to expedite this case with a ruling in mid to late August, so it is unlikely to even matter. And this is not directed at any one person, but lets get a couple of facts straight: 1. No player in the history of the league has ever been suspended for not cooperating with an investigation. I have heard this used as the "real" reasoning for Brady's suspension but it has never applied in the history of the league and its not as if Brady is the first player to ever not cooperate with an investigation(which according to Ted Wells Brady did fully cooperate). 2. So that being said this suspension should fully be based on the incident which is more probably than not having knowledge of an equipment violation. So how is that worthy of any suspension? 3. The cell phone is completely irrelevant whether or not it was broken intentionally like reported by Stephen A Smith or whether Brady simply just got a new phone because his old one broke. The NFL doesnt even have the right to request Brady turns over his phone. So whether or not the phone had anything on it is irrelevant because the NFL didnt have the right to ask for that much less use it against him regardless. Doesn't matter. Having Brady's phone would have made all the difference in the investigation. The fact that he destroyed it (after he knew they wanted information from it might I add) would have made it harder for the NFL to find the information. Tell me, which would be easier? Searching through a phone manually, or having to search ion trails to find the information that was in the phone? The fact remains that Tom Brady didn't tell them he destroyed it until after the investigation was over. They didn't know that information was available in that fashion and Brady was still refusing to give up that information. Giving it up when he did would have only lengthened the appeal process, which could have potentially allowed him to play Week 1 and beyond without an injunction. You can buy all of Tom Brady's excuses that you want, but it won't be enough to get the suspension wiped out. Again, if Tom Brady was completely innocent, he could have had this thing over and done with months ago if he had just handed over his phone when the investigation asked for it in the first place. Why didn't he allow the NFL to search his message history before the investigation was over? Why did he keep refusing to give up information until after the investigation and appeal? It doesn't matter if he was switching phones and he "habitually" destroys the old ones. That habit had to have been broken for the investigation, if only to preserve his "innocence". Brady has not acted like an innocent man. He has acted like a man desperately trying to find a loophole out of this without the actual truth coming out. 1. That is because other players cooperate with the NFL. It is in the CBA that the NFL has the right to discipline players for not cooperating with an investigation. 2. It is more than an simple equipment violation. This is an integrity issue. 3. The NFL has the right to request it. They are entitled to that. They just don't have the power to forcefully obtain information. Any investigations by the NFL into its players relies completely on cooperation between both parties. If a player refuses to cooperate, the NFL has sufficient reason to believe that they aren't telling the truth or they aren't innocent. Tom Brady refused to give up his phone due to an invasion of his privacy, but you can search key words within conversations to find things that are relevant to the investigation. If there isn't anything, Tom Brady had nothing to fear.
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Post by patriotsk1d on Jul 31, 2015 12:19:41 GMT -5
I think I will just give daily updates( not using ESPN's agenda) to keep everyone honest, although everyone is and should be entitled to their own opinion. Chris Mortenson, the guy who overblew this entire thing with a false report stating 11 of the 12 footballs were 2.5 PSI under the legal limit(not even remotely true) will be on the Dennis and Callahan show tomorrow morning to discuss his initial report. While I have never been a fan of Mortenson I doubt he fabricated the original report and think it is far more likely one of the NFL's higher up leaked false information to him. Dennis and Callahan will not let him off easy. Still there is a lot of hype regarding this interview and it wouldnt shock me if Mortenson or ESPN pulls the plug on it in the next few hours. cityofchampsToo bad your fun is about to run out. Your huge deal about the broken cell phone is looking dumber and dumber every day. Another story that doesnt fit your agenda: www.wired.com/2015/07/even-tom-brady-smash-phone-itd-make-zero-sense/?mbid=social_twitterHere is a quote from the Wells report: "We don't even know if a violation occurred, but if one did, we "think" we know who probably did it." Sounds very conclusive. JuggsGoing to have to agree after further research than an injunction is not by any means a guarantee. However judge Berman is expected to expedite this case with a ruling in mid to late August, so it is unlikely to even matter. And this is not directed at any one person, but lets get a couple of facts straight: 1. No player in the history of the league has ever been suspended for not cooperating with an investigation. I have heard this used as the "real" reasoning for Brady's suspension but it has never applied in the history of the league and its not as if Brady is the first player to ever not cooperate with an investigation(which according to Ted Wells Brady did fully cooperate). 2. So that being said this suspension should fully be based on the incident which is more probably than not having knowledge of an equipment violation. So how is that worthy of any suspension? 3. The cell phone is completely irrelevant whether or not it was broken intentionally like reported by Stephen A Smith or whether Brady simply just got a new phone because his old one broke. The NFL doesnt even have the right to request Brady turns over his phone. So whether or not the phone had anything on it is irrelevant because the NFL didnt have the right to ask for that much less use it against him regardless. Doesn't matter. Having Brady's phone would have made all the difference in the investigation. The fact that he destroyed it (after he knew they wanted information from it might I add) would have made it harder for the NFL to find the information. Tell me, which would be easier? Searching through a phone manually, or having to search ion trails to find the information that was in the phone? The fact remains that Tom Brady didn't tell them he destroyed it until after the investigation was over. They didn't know that information was available in that fashion and Brady was still refusing to give up that information. Giving it up when he did would have only lengthened the appeal process, which could have potentially allowed him to play Week 1 and beyond without an injunction. You can buy all of Tom Brady's excuses that you want, but it won't be enough to get the suspension wiped out. Again, if Tom Brady was completely innocent, he could have had this thing over and done with months ago if he had just handed over his phone when the investigation asked for it in the first place. Why didn't he allow the NFL to search his message history before the investigation was over? Why did he keep refusing to give up information until after the investigation and appeal? It doesn't matter if he was switching phones and he "habitually" destroys the old ones. That habit had to have been broken for the investigation, if only to preserve his "innocence". Brady has not acted like an innocent man. He has acted like a man desperately trying to find a loophole out of this without the actual truth coming out. 1. That is because other players cooperate with the NFL. It is in the CBA that the NFL has the right to discipline players for not cooperating with an investigation. 2. It is more than an simple equipment violation. This is an integrity issue. 3. The NFL has the right to request it. They are entitled to that. They just don't have the power to forcefully obtain information. Any investigations by the NFL into its players relies completely on cooperation between both parties. If a player refuses to cooperate, the NFL has sufficient reason to believe that they aren't telling the truth or they aren't innocent. Tom Brady refused to give up his phone due to an invasion of his privacy, but you can search key words within conversations to find things that are relevant to the investigation. If there isn't anything, Tom Brady had nothing to fear. Wells said that he didnt even want to see the phone, just the records of it. Brady offered up that data and the NFL no longer wanted it. But you are ignoring that because it doesnt fit your agenda. You are incredible biased and have so many double standards. Your starting QB has far more integrity violations than Brady ever will. Your HC clearly tried to trip a player in the middle of the game. Brady will play week one and we will beat you guys by at least 20.
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Post by Morkim on Jul 31, 2015 12:23:54 GMT -5
Here's what I've pretty much figured.
Timeline: investigation starts, Wells gets access to how ever many cell phones. He asks Brady for his. Brady has noods of his hawt wife or something says nah. Figuring refusing the cell phone is a 50k fine give or take (you know, the fine Farve got for refusing to turn over his phone) so he upgrades his phone after he makes it clear he isn't going to turn it over anyway.
Investigation ends. Goodall says "lol got u" and uses the phone as a big reason for suspending him. (Where else have players been suspended for not cooperating? The Patriots kicker refused and he didn't even get a fine.)
So Brady goes oh shit, what a douche. Well I need to do whatever I can do to overturn that. So I'll go to the phone company. They can't give me whole text messages, but I got a list of who I text. Goodall says nah that's too much work. Appeal upheld.
Seriously. The phone stuff is a joke. It's an excuse he's using to over punish Brady when there's zero precedent. And as far as the "it's an integrity issue instead of a equipment issue" why is this an integrity issue? There's no integrity issue in DUIs. Equipment violations are in the CBA. Can you really just pick and choose which ones are more of an integrity issue than others? lol
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