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Post by cityofchamps on Jul 31, 2015 19:18:29 GMT -5
Doesn't matter. Having Brady's phone would have made all the difference in the investigation. The fact that he destroyed it (after he knew they wanted information from it might I add) would have made it harder for the NFL to find the information. Tell me, which would be easier? Searching through a phone manually, or having to search ion trails to find the information that was in the phone? The fact remains that Tom Brady didn't tell them he destroyed it until after the investigation was over. They didn't know that information was available in that fashion and Brady was still refusing to give up that information. Giving it up when he did would have only lengthened the appeal process, which could have potentially allowed him to play Week 1 and beyond without an injunction. You can buy all of Tom Brady's excuses that you want, but it won't be enough to get the suspension wiped out. Again, if Tom Brady was completely innocent, he could have had this thing over and done with months ago if he had just handed over his phone when the investigation asked for it in the first place. Why didn't he allow the NFL to search his message history before the investigation was over? Why did he keep refusing to give up information until after the investigation and appeal? It doesn't matter if he was switching phones and he "habitually" destroys the old ones. That habit had to have been broken for the investigation, if only to preserve his "innocence". Brady has not acted like an innocent man. He has acted like a man desperately trying to find a loophole out of this without the actual truth coming out. 1. That is because other players cooperate with the NFL. It is in the CBA that the NFL has the right to discipline players for not cooperating with an investigation. 2. It is more than an simple equipment violation. This is an integrity issue. 3. The NFL has the right to request it. They are entitled to that. They just don't have the power to forcefully obtain information. Any investigations by the NFL into its players relies completely on cooperation between both parties. If a player refuses to cooperate, the NFL has sufficient reason to believe that they aren't telling the truth or they aren't innocent. Tom Brady refused to give up his phone due to an invasion of his privacy, but you can search key words within conversations to find things that are relevant to the investigation. If there isn't anything, Tom Brady had nothing to fear. Wells said that he didnt even want to see the phone, just the records of it. Brady offered up that data and the NFL no longer wanted it. But you are ignoring that because it doesnt fit your agenda. You are incredible biased and have so many double standards. Your starting QB has far more integrity violations than Brady ever will. Your HC clearly tried to trip a player in the middle of the game. Brady will play week one and we will beat you guys by at least 20. Says the pot to the kettle.
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Post by patriotsk1d on Jul 31, 2015 19:27:00 GMT -5
Wells said that he didnt even want to see the phone, just the records of it. Brady offered up that data and the NFL no longer wanted it. But you are ignoring that because it doesnt fit your agenda. You are incredible biased and have so many double standards. Your starting QB has far more integrity violations than Brady ever will. Your HC clearly tried to trip a player in the middle of the game. Brady will play week one and we will beat you guys by at least 20. Says the pot to the kettle. Go ahead and give me some examples please. Everyone has a difficult time acknowledging their own personal bias, but I would love to hear what you actually think mine are. According to you possible having knowledge of an equipment violation is worse than DUI, Rape, and tripping opposing players. Goodell is at terrible person, but not if he unfairly punishes New England.
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Post by steelers54 on Jul 31, 2015 19:40:19 GMT -5
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Post by cityofchamps on Jul 31, 2015 19:44:38 GMT -5
Says the pot to the kettle. Go ahead and give me some examples please. Everyone has a difficult time acknowledging their own personal bias, but I would love to hear what you actually think mine are. According to you possible having knowledge of an equipment violation is worse than DUI, Rape, and tripping opposing players. Goodell is at terrible person, but not if he unfairly punishes New England. And there is your double standard right there. You are so quick to point out where Steelers' players have done wrong without ever giving them a chance of innocence. I guarantee you 100% that if Tom Brady had the EXACT same allegations that Ben did with the EXACT same circumstances, or was caught driving under the influence, or if Belichick was caught on camera jumping out of the way of an opposing player running down the sideline, you would defend them till your face turned blue. I guarantee it. You cry bias every which way when people come down on the Patriots when they are in the spotlight for the wrong reasons. Get off your goddamn high horse and accept how biased you and every other Patriots fan is when it comes to Brady. And don't say you aren't. You are. Everyone knows it here and you do, even if you won't accept it. Yea, sure I have bias. Everyone does. Nothing would be sweeter than for Tom f**king Brady to be brought down to earth and be looked at as a human being instead of the god people make him out to be. Sure, I WANT Tom Brady to be guilty, but he is just making it that much easier for everyone to think he is. He has not acted innocent by any means, and sure, the NFL has some questions to answer themselves. That said, you won't dissuade me from my belief and I won't from yours. Just accept that fact we have different point of views and move on. I am against Tom Brady on this one, though that doesn't mean I am for the NFL. They probably got this wrong. 2 or 3 games would have been right, not 4, but they made it 4 to protect their image and that is the only reason. Nothing Tom Brady has done deserves 4 games, but something needed to be done and he and the Patriots gave the NFL no choice in the matter with their smug attitude that they would get off scott free because Kraft was buddies with Goodell.
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Post by cityofchamps on Jul 31, 2015 20:04:12 GMT -5
So now I hear the NFL and NFLPA have been ordered by the courts to agree to a settlement. When I hear settlement, I hear something that is between what both sides want. The NFL wants four games. The NFLPA wants it wiped out. If both sides agree to a deal that will end this once and for all, it most likely will be something in between.
They say a fair deal is one where both sides aren't happy with it (bonus points if you know where I got that from). Let's hope that is going to be the case.
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Post by Morkim on Jul 31, 2015 20:09:22 GMT -5
So now I hear the NFL and NFLPA have been ordered by the courts to agree to a settlement. When I hear settlement, I hear something that is between what both sides want. The NFL wants four games. The NFLPA wants it wiped out. If both sides agree to a deal that will end this once and for all, it most likely will be something in between. They say a fair deal is one where both sides aren't happy with it (bonus points if you know where I got that from). Let's hope that is going to be the case. Because that'd be a super win for you, right? lol I'm convinced Tom Brady has done enough to convince people who say "I want Brady to be guilty" that he is guilty. It's just that frankly, that's a lot of people.
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Post by patriotsk1d on Jul 31, 2015 20:50:57 GMT -5
Go ahead and give me some examples please. Everyone has a difficult time acknowledging their own personal bias, but I would love to hear what you actually think mine are. According to you possible having knowledge of an equipment violation is worse than DUI, Rape, and tripping opposing players. Goodell is at terrible person, but not if he unfairly punishes New England. And there is your double standard right there. You are so quick to point out where Steelers' players have done wrong without ever giving them a chance of innocence. I guarantee you 100% that if Tom Brady had the EXACT same allegations that Ben did with the EXACT same circumstances, or was caught driving under the influence, or if Belichick was caught on camera jumping out of the way of an opposing player running down the sideline, you would defend them till your face turned blue. I guarantee it. You cry bias every which way when people come down on the Patriots when they are in the spotlight for the wrong reasons. Get off your goddamn high horse and accept how biased you and every other Patriots fan is when it comes to Brady. And don't say you aren't. You are. Everyone knows it here and you do, even if you won't accept it. Yea, sure I have bias. Everyone does. Nothing would be sweeter than for Tom f**king Brady to be brought down to earth and be looked at as a human being instead of the god people make him out to be. Sure, I WANT Tom Brady to be guilty, but he is just making it that much easier for everyone to think he is. He has not acted innocent by any means, and sure, the NFL has some questions to answer themselves. That said, you won't dissuade me from my belief and I won't from yours. Just accept that fact we have different point of views and move on. I am against Tom Brady on this one, though that doesn't mean I am for the NFL. They probably got this wrong. 2 or 3 games would have been right, not 4, but they made it 4 to protect their image and that is the only reason. Nothing Tom Brady has done deserves 4 games, but something needed to be done and he and the Patriots gave the NFL no choice in the matter with their smug attitude that they would get off scott free because Kraft was buddies with Goodell. Lol I have never defended a Patriots players criminal actions before. I did not defend Alfonzo Dennard after his DUI nor Hernandez after his murder. Belichick has never tripped a player, only two NFL coaches have ever done that... None of my players are rapists so that isnt even comparable. You are the same person who thinks "Goodell destroyed the tapes", but then goes ahead and doesnt mind the way this case is being handled. lol your double standards are laughable. I am bias yes, but you cant come up with one double standard that would also apply to your team...
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Post by patriotsk1d on Jul 31, 2015 20:51:27 GMT -5
So now I hear the NFL and NFLPA have been ordered by the courts to agree to a settlement. When I hear settlement, I hear something that is between what both sides want. The NFL wants four games. The NFLPA wants it wiped out. If both sides agree to a deal that will end this once and for all, it most likely will be something in between. They say a fair deal is one where both sides aren't happy with it (bonus points if you know where I got that from). Let's hope that is going to be the case. Good luck with that. Brady is all in at this point and no way he settles for anything other than no suspension.
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Post by 101mitch on Jul 31, 2015 21:15:43 GMT -5
I think I will just give daily updates( not using ESPN's agenda) to keep everyone honest, although everyone is and should be entitled to their own opinion. Chris Mortenson, the guy who overblew this entire thing with a false report stating 11 of the 12 footballs were 2.5 PSI under the legal limit(not even remotely true) will be on the Dennis and Callahan show tomorrow morning to discuss his initial report. While I have never been a fan of Mortenson I doubt he fabricated the original report and think it is far more likely one of the NFL's higher up leaked false information to him. Dennis and Callahan will not let him off easy. Still there is a lot of hype regarding this interview and it wouldnt shock me if Mortenson or ESPN pulls the plug on it in the next few hours. cityofchampsToo bad your fun is about to run out. Your huge deal about the broken cell phone is looking dumber and dumber every day. Another story that doesnt fit your agenda: www.wired.com/2015/07/even-tom-brady-smash-phone-itd-make-zero-sense/?mbid=social_twitterHere is a quote from the Wells report: "We don't even know if a violation occurred, but if one did, we "think" we know who probably did it." Sounds very conclusive. JuggsGoing to have to agree after further research than an injunction is not by any means a guarantee. However judge Berman is expected to expedite this case with a ruling in mid to late August, so it is unlikely to even matter. And this is not directed at any one person, but lets get a couple of facts straight: 1. No player in the history of the league has ever been suspended for not cooperating with an investigation. I have heard this used as the "real" reasoning for Brady's suspension but it has never applied in the history of the league and its not as if Brady is the first player to ever not cooperate with an investigation(which according to Ted Wells Brady did fully cooperate). 2. So that being said this suspension should fully be based on the incident which is more probably than not having knowledge of an equipment violation. So how is that worthy of any suspension? 3. The cell phone is completely irrelevant whether or not it was broken intentionally like reported by Stephen A Smith or whether Brady simply just got a new phone because his old one broke. The NFL doesnt even have the right to request Brady turns over his phone. So whether or not the phone had anything on it is irrelevant because the NFL didnt have the right to ask for that much less use it against him regardless. Doesn't matter. Having Brady's phone would have made all the difference in the investigation. The fact that he destroyed it (after he knew they wanted information from it might I add) would have made it harder for the NFL to find the information. Tell me, which would be easier? Searching through a phone manually, or having to search ion trails to find the information that was in the phone? The fact remains that Tom Brady didn't tell them he destroyed it until after the investigation was over. They didn't know that information was available in that fashion and Brady was still refusing to give up that information. Giving it up when he did would have only lengthened the appeal process, which could have potentially allowed him to play Week 1 and beyond without an injunction. You can buy all of Tom Brady's excuses that you want, but it won't be enough to get the suspension wiped out. Again, if Tom Brady was completely innocent, he could have had this thing over and done with months ago if he had just handed over his phone when the investigation asked for it in the first place. Why didn't he allow the NFL to search his message history before the investigation was over? Why did he keep refusing to give up information until after the investigation and appeal? It doesn't matter if he was switching phones and he "habitually" destroys the old ones. That habit had to have been broken for the investigation, if only to preserve his "innocence". Brady has not acted like an innocent man. He has acted like a man desperately trying to find a loophole out of this without the actual truth coming out.
1. That is because other players cooperate with the NFL. It is in the CBA that the NFL has the right to discipline players for not cooperating with an investigation.
2. It is more than an simple equipment violation. This is an integrity issue. 3. The NFL has the right to request it. They are entitled to that. They just don't have the power to forcefully obtain information. Any investigations by the NFL into its players relies completely on cooperation between both parties. If a player refuses to cooperate, the NFL has sufficient reason to believe that they aren't telling the truth or they aren't innocent. Tom Brady refused to give up his phone due to an invasion of his privacy, but you can search key words within conversations to find things that are relevant to the investigation. If there isn't anything, Tom Brady had nothing to fear. You sound like all my teachers. You can "tell" when someone is guilty. Who cares if Brady hasn't acted like an innocent man?!?! If I skip an optional drug test, am I on drugs? If this is about "integrity" then aren't ALL equipment violations about integrity? When Clay Matthews wore the wrong color shoes, why wasn't he suspended?
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Post by cityofchamps on Jul 31, 2015 21:30:23 GMT -5
And there is your double standard right there. You are so quick to point out where Steelers' players have done wrong without ever giving them a chance of innocence. I guarantee you 100% that if Tom Brady had the EXACT same allegations that Ben did with the EXACT same circumstances, or was caught driving under the influence, or if Belichick was caught on camera jumping out of the way of an opposing player running down the sideline, you would defend them till your face turned blue. I guarantee it. You cry bias every which way when people come down on the Patriots when they are in the spotlight for the wrong reasons. Get off your goddamn high horse and accept how biased you and every other Patriots fan is when it comes to Brady. And don't say you aren't. You are. Everyone knows it here and you do, even if you won't accept it. Yea, sure I have bias. Everyone does. Nothing would be sweeter than for Tom f**king Brady to be brought down to earth and be looked at as a human being instead of the god people make him out to be. Sure, I WANT Tom Brady to be guilty, but he is just making it that much easier for everyone to think he is. He has not acted innocent by any means, and sure, the NFL has some questions to answer themselves. That said, you won't dissuade me from my belief and I won't from yours. Just accept that fact we have different point of views and move on. I am against Tom Brady on this one, though that doesn't mean I am for the NFL. They probably got this wrong. 2 or 3 games would have been right, not 4, but they made it 4 to protect their image and that is the only reason. Nothing Tom Brady has done deserves 4 games, but something needed to be done and he and the Patriots gave the NFL no choice in the matter with their smug attitude that they would get off scott free because Kraft was buddies with Goodell. Lol I have never defended a Patriots players criminal actions before. I did not defend Alfonzo Dennard after his DUI nor Hernandez after his murder. Belichick has never tripped a player, only two NFL coaches have ever done that... None of my players are rapists so that isnt even comparable. You are the same person who thinks "Goodell destroyed the tapes", but then goes ahead and doesnt mind the way this case is being handled. lol your double standards are laughable. I am bias yes, but you cant come up with one double standard that would also apply to your team... Bullcrap. You defended Hernandez up to the moment his conviction came out. Weren't you the one saying there wasn't enough to proclaim him guilty? That he was going to be announced innocent? Don't give me that crap. You were all about standing up for Hernandez all throughout the trial process. Ben isn't a rapist either. He is just an accused rapist. There is a difference. Just because there was a "Settlement" in the case doesn't mean he is automatically guilty. If you think the settlement is the thing that makes Ben a rapist, then if Tom Brady is suspended for any amount of games in 2015, then you have to proclaim him guilty of cheating. Otherwise, that is a clear double standard. Also, Mike Tomlin never "tripped" Jacoby Jones (please correct your misinformation). He jumped out of the way which may or may not have slowed Jones down. He was eventually tackled by the Defense. Mike Tomlin made no contact whatsoever with Jacoby Jones. Look at the video.
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