rey713
NFL Draft pick
The King of the 713
Posts: 1,307
|
Post by rey713 on Feb 12, 2014 10:03:43 GMT -5
Fair enough. What about grown adults that have relations with teens that "consent"? Should we do away with minimum age laws for consent because "love knows no boundaries"? No we shouldn't because those laws are in place to protect people who aren't necessarily old enough or mature enough to make those decisions for themselves. To me a consenting act is between two adults. Or in the case of teenagers teens with teens of around the same age, and of the legal age to actually participate in sexual acts.. So really I don't see your point... But it doesn't "harm" anyone, so why should society care? That's the same message pro-gays use. Cocaine doesn't hurt anyone but the user, so why should the government care? The point is that the same argument that is used to promote same-gender relationships can be used for numerous things that are illegal. I'm not saying make homosexuality illegal, but if you use that argument then why not use it for other things?
|
|
|
Post by saskabronco on Feb 12, 2014 10:24:35 GMT -5
No we shouldn't because those laws are in place to protect people who aren't necessarily old enough or mature enough to make those decisions for themselves. To me a consenting act is between two adults. Or in the case of teenagers teens with teens of around the same age, and of the legal age to actually participate in sexual acts.. So really I don't see your point... But it doesn't "harm" anyone, so why should society care? That's the same message pro-gays use. Cocaine doesn't hurt anyone but the user, so why should the government care? The point is that the same argument that is used to promote same-gender relationships can be used for numerous things that are illegal. I'm not saying make homosexuality illegal, but if you use that argument then why not use it for other things? It absolutely harms someone if a grown adult takes advantage of a child that doesn't know any better. Cocaine hurts the user. You said it yourself that it hurts the user. In turn that can affect others in society. That is why the government cares. Homosexuality is not the same as beastiality or sex with children or using drugs. It is a separate issue that needs to be treated as such. We are talking about two adults loving each other and having sex. Stopping two people from different races from having sex would raise a shit storm everywhere, but when you change the focus from a race to a gender, all of a sudden it's everyone's business?
|
|
rey713
NFL Draft pick
The King of the 713
Posts: 1,307
|
Post by rey713 on Feb 12, 2014 10:25:21 GMT -5
The prophecies don't mean a thing when there is no evidence that they actually happened. For all we know someone wrote a bunch of prophecies and then centuries later, someone who read those prophecies wrote more stories fulfilling them. That isn't evidence unless you believe the book has divine origins. Like I said before, it all boils down to your faith. You need the faith in order to believe it. Without that, it just looks like a bunch of made up stories. The theories of evolution and the Big Bang are simply theories at this point. No one is saying they happened for sure. But scientists are constantly doing research to better understand these things and the more they discover, the more those make sense. You belittle those arguments by saying men came from monkeys and the world miraculously fell into place. There is evidence that our make up is incredibly similar to monkeys and since we know evolution does happen in many parts of nature, it makes sense to believe that us, and other bipedal animals evolved from a similar base. And with the Big Bang, they know the universe is expanding, which means it is moving away from something. So the theory is that there must be a point that started the expansion. There isn't much that claims to know what started the movement. It's just a theory. You belittle the theories by taking logical arguments and treating them like some fairy tale. So let's look at your beliefs. You believe that one human came, then god made the second out of his rib. You believe that there's as a talking snake that convinced them to do something bad. You believe that a guy built a boat and gathered two of every single animal in the world and waited out a worldwide flood, then repopulated the entire world with what had to have been incestual relationships. Oh, and you also believe that it all miraculously fell into place thanks to some greater being who also just miraculously fell into place. Sound about right? Sounds just as absurd to me as your rip on Scientology to me. I'll repeat myself again now. All of the logic you use to belittle all the other forms of faith can be used the exact same way towards your faith. We're all atheists when it comes to 99.9% of religions! I just take it that 0.1% further. And to confirm, science is not a faith and I don't 'believe in science'. If what I gave you before was so easy, why did you give such a poor answer to it all? EDIT: What is a Scientific Theory? A scientific theory summarizes a hypothesis or group of hypotheses that have been supported with repeated testing. If enough evidence accumulates to support a hypothesis, it moves to the next step—known as a theory—in the scientific method and becomes accepted as a valid explanation of a phenomenon. It's not like someone just made up an idea and said yeah that's how the world works (that's more so how religion works, they are nothing more than unproven hypotheses). These theories have been repeatedly tested and are accepted based on accumulated evidence. I explained the one about the fall of Jerusalem to the Romans that Jesus foretold, yet you didn't accept that one because you think Jesus' words in the gospel of Luke were just added in and written AFTER 70 CE (during the siege of Jerusalem). Considering that "Acts", the SECOND of Luke's writings, was written before the siege of Rome as well, how could an earlier piece be written afterwards? --- What's your (or science's) idea on who the first "man" was? The snake wasn't just a snake, it was Satan the Devil using it like a puppet. Incest was necessary for Noah's offspring for obvious reasons. And everything didn't just "fall into place". It was designed that way by the Creator. It's a perfect distance away from the Sun with an atmosphere that supports life.
|
|
|
Post by saskabronco on Feb 12, 2014 10:47:14 GMT -5
I explained the one about the fall of Jerusalem to the Romans that Jesus foretold, yet you didn't accept that one because you think Jesus' words in the gospel of Luke were just added in and written AFTER 70 CE (during the siege of Jerusalem). Considering that "Acts", the SECOND of Luke's writings, was written before the siege of Rome as well, how could an earlier piece be written afterwards? The majority of scholars believe that Luke's gospel was written after 75 CE. Only a small minority believe otherwise. Acts is thought to have been written between 50 and 150 CE. And the reasoning that many people use to state this, is the there are certain things written that may coincide with certain events from earlier on (prior to 70 CE and the fall of Jerusalem), however the fact that many new testament writings are deemed to share a common original source 'Q', explains how certain events that take place come from an earlier source, yet much of what is written seems to come from later. I am not saying that you are wrong, I am saying you have zero proof that you are right. What you provide is not proof, it is speculation based on your own personal faith, but many, many people find flaws in those theories. What's your (or science's) idea on who the first "man" was? The snake wasn't just a snake, it was Satan the Devil using it like a puppet. Incest was necessary for Noah's offspring for obvious reasons. And everything didn't just "fall into place". It was designed that way by the Creator. It's a perfect distance away from the Sun with an atmosphere that supports life. Where you keep running into problems here Rey is your insistence on making assumptions. Science doesn't claim to have all the answers like Religion does. Science is constantly asking questions and looking for answers, and for every answer they find, they find more questions. No one knows who the first man was. Based on how the theory of human evolution works, there wasn't a 'first man', there was a very slow drawn out process where primates started evolving and developing more 'human-like' features. If we had the luxury of analyzing every single creature that ever existed on the planet, we might be able to make a distinction as to precisely when the evolution chain started being a 'man' rather than a primate, but sadly we don't have that luxury. Scientists study what remains they can find and they put the pieces together the best they can, like a puzzle missing 90% of the pieces. Explain something to me then, if you think the theories put forth about the earth's history are so absurd. How do you explain dinosaur fossils? They aren't mentioned in the bible and they are millions of years old. Why did God put them there?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2014 12:49:00 GMT -5
"Gay people aren't any more special than the rest of us. Am I saying they deserve better rights? No, I am saying equal. It means they should be treated the same as everyone should be. If other people are being treated different for some physical or social difference, I also want them to be treated equally. I want you, me, the black guy down the street, the gay guy I went to school with, the elderly woman in a home, etc to all be treated the same. If you are for everyone's rights then you are with me. " - Bronco
Ok...I just want to ask this one last thing...
Tell me the things that the gay community are not being treated equally about...Other than marriage,because we both know why that is.
Marriage is sacred. Marriage comes from the bible. Marriage comes from God Right? If it didnt come from God,then where did it come from? Did somebody make it up?
So...other than the marriage thing....Tell me how the gay community is not being treated equally?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2014 12:53:58 GMT -5
BTW >..Saska...I already explained the dinosaurs in the bible in the religion thread...lol
|
|
|
Post by Jindred on Feb 12, 2014 13:03:57 GMT -5
No we shouldn't because those laws are in place to protect people who aren't necessarily old enough or mature enough to make those decisions for themselves. To me a consenting act is between two adults. Or in the case of teenagers teens with teens of around the same age, and of the legal age to actually participate in sexual acts.. So really I don't see your point... But it doesn't "harm" anyone, so why should society care? That's the same message pro-gays use. Cocaine doesn't hurt anyone but the user, so why should the government care? The point is that the same argument that is used to promote same-gender relationships can be used for numerous things that are illegal. I'm not saying make homosexuality illegal, but if you use that argument then why not use it for other things? It may not always harm someone for a teen and a older person to have sex but it has the potential to be harmful to the younger person as younger people who are more immature can be used and manipulated into doing things they may not truly want to do all for the idea that they are "in love". The law is in place to protect people who are to young and immature from being manipulated by older people. Cocaine is illegal for good reason because it severely harms the individual who is taking part in it AND it has the propensity to harm others. Could you imagine if cocaine were legal and a mainstream drug? Alcohol causes enough problems for society as is, and have you ever heard the term "Its like________ on cocaine?" It just ramps shit up to a whole new level so it would be like alcohol on cocaine! This difference between you using the argument for other things, is many of those other things harm people whether others or themselves or animals. Being gay doesn't harm anything or anyone in anyway. There is no taking advantage of someone who doesn't know any better, there is not self harm, it doesn't affect anyone else in anyway so it doesn't matter. You can make the argument that it affects their eternal soul or whatever, but there are an estimated 2200 religions in the world. Some of which are ok with people being gay. So basically its a shot in the dark what is going to happen to their eternal soul. My theory is might as well be happy while we are here and find somebody to love because we all seem to agree that "here" is at least somewhat a real thing as we are all taking part in it!
|
|
|
Post by Jindred on Feb 12, 2014 13:15:01 GMT -5
"Gay people aren't any more special than the rest of us. Am I saying they deserve better rights? No, I am saying equal. It means they should be treated the same as everyone should be. If other people are being treated different for some physical or social difference, I also want them to be treated equally. I want you, me, the black guy down the street, the gay guy I went to school with, the elderly woman in a home, etc to all be treated the same. If you are for everyone's rights then you are with me. " - Bronco Ok...I just want to ask this one last thing... Tell me the things that the gay community are not being treated equally about...Other than marriage,because we both know why that is. Marriage is sacred. Marriage comes from the bible. Marriage comes from God Right? If it didnt come from God,then where did it come from? Did somebody make it up?So...other than the marriage thing....Tell me how the gay community is not being treated equally? Marriage isn't really sacred, at least not any more. With people constantly getting divorced, cheating on each other, and other such crap is it honestly sacred? Also marriage predates Christianity, Judaism, Islam and the Bible by a good long time so marriage doesn't really come from the Bible. From god.. well a case can be made that everything comes from god so I can't really argue that. But in my eyes marriage is a creation of man. Also why isn't two gay people getting married not sacred? To me nothing is more sacred than two people who love each other enough to want to commit the rest of their lives to each whether man and woman, man and man or woman and woman! The argument "Because it says in the bible" isn't enough because not all marriage is about the bible! I by all means agree that a christian wedding for them is out of the question. If Christianity doesn't want them as a part of it than that's its prerogative. However what about marriage without religion? what about a pagan marriage? Marriage predates the bible so the bible doesn't have the only claim to it!
|
|
|
Post by saskabronco on Feb 12, 2014 13:20:08 GMT -5
"Gay people aren't any more special than the rest of us. Am I saying they deserve better rights? No, I am saying equal. It means they should be treated the same as everyone should be. If other people are being treated different for some physical or social difference, I also want them to be treated equally. I want you, me, the black guy down the street, the gay guy I went to school with, the elderly woman in a home, etc to all be treated the same. If you are for everyone's rights then you are with me. " - Bronco Ok...I just want to ask this one last thing... Tell me the things that the gay community are not being treated equally about...Other than marriage,because we both know why that is. Marriage is sacred. Marriage comes from the bible. Marriage comes from God Right? If it didnt come from God,then where did it come from? Did somebody make it up? So...other than the marriage thing....Tell me how the gay community is not being treated equally? The marriage right is enough for this to be a problem. Don't pass it off as not as important as other rights. We both know why the marriage thing is an issue. Christian people think marriage is purely a God thing but that is not correct. I am getting married this year and I don't believe in God, so should I not be allowed to get married either? No, because the definition of marriage is broader than your own view of it. "Marriage (also called matrimony or wedlock) is a socially or ritually recognized union or legal contract between spouses that establishes rights and obligations between them, between them and their children, and between them and their in-laws.[1] The definition of marriage varies according to different cultures, but it is principally an institution in which interpersonal relationships, usually intimate and sexual, are acknowledged... Individuals may marry for several reasons, including: legal, social, libidinal, emotional, financial, spiritual, and religious." It doesn't have to be religious, considering there are many non-religious people who get married. It is not purely a religious, thing that came from the bible. Many cultures have a form of marriage and have had it long before they were introduced to the bible. It doesn't matter what else is oppressing the gay community, that is enough for it to be a problem. That's like punching someone in the face and then saying "Why are you so mad? Ya I punched you in the face and we both know why I did it, but aside from that, why could you possibly be so mad?" And I don't remember your explanation of the dinosaurs from the religion thread. I would think that if you made a valid point I would have remembered, but please explain to me again how that works. I am not going to search through the entire religion thread for one post.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2014 13:29:53 GMT -5
If marriage did not come from God...Then please tell me why the gay community cares so much for the right to marry,,that according to you....some numskull made up a long time ago.
BTW...I assume that marriage is the only thing since you didnt mention anything else....and the reason why is because there is no other reason,that doesnt affect all of the earths population.
|
|